(HKR-11-13-24) On a recent episode of Hard Knock Radio, host Davey D sat down with Tim Wise, a prominent anti-racist educator and author, to unpack the complexities of American politics and race. The conversation ranged from electoral outcomes to the significance of cultural engagement in shaping political ideologies. With his extensive experience in educating on issues of race and racism, Wise shared invaluable insights into the realities of the MAGA movement, the role of media, and the pitfalls of political strategies that ignore cultural competency.
Tim Wise on the Resilience of Reactionary Politics
When asked whether he was surprised by the election’s outcome, Wise noted that while he was surprised by the closeness of the race, he wasn’t shocked by the return of a reactionary figure like Donald Trump. As Wise put it, “I’m never shocked when America the noun decides to America the verb… When America goes out and Americas and does what we do… it’s reverting to type.”
Wise went on to explain that the political landscape had shifted back to a familiar and troubling place—a resurgence of reactionary white masculinity embodied in Trump. He compared the Obama years to an intermission at a Broadway show, with the return of Trump signaling the resumption of a narrative that has always been at the core of American politics.
The MAGA Movement: More Than Just White People
A central theme in the conversation was the underlying force driving MAGA politics—racism and misogyny. Wise made it clear that while many factors contribute to the movement’s rise, “the yeast that has always made the MAGA bread rise is racism and misogyny.” He explained that, while Trump may not have garnered votes solely for these reasons, “without the yeast, it’s not bread, it’s a cracker.”
This brought the discussion to how the MAGA movement has grown more inclusive of people from various racial and ethnic backgrounds. Wise pointed out the paradox of groups like Latinos or Asian-Americans becoming more involved in Trump’s base. As he explained, “there’s a long history of immigrant groups… trying to get closer to the top than the bottom” in American society. For some, aligning with the MAGA movement was a form of self-preservation.
Media and Cultural Competency: A Missed Opportunity for Democrats
A significant part of the conversation focused on the Democratic Party’s failure to effectively engage with alternative media outlets. As Wise pointed out, “The right has always been better at this than the left,” in terms of utilizing podcasts, live streams, and social media platforms to spread their message. The Democrats, on the other hand, have failed to adapt, preferring to speak through traditional outlets like the New York Times and CNN, which do not resonate with key voter groups, particularly younger audiences. Wise emphasized, “If you go on those venues, it’s nonstop male grievance, misogyny… it’s casual racism, conspiracy theories… that’s what plays.”
In contrast, Trump has cultivated relationships with these platforms, gaining access to broader, younger, and more diverse audiences. Wise stressed the importance of not just showing up in these spaces but engaging with the underlying grievances that drive them: “You’re going to have to challenge the misogyny directly. You’re going to have to challenge the racism directly.”
Understanding Whiteness as a Political Project
Another key point in the conversation was the idea of “whiteness” as a flexible political project. Wise argued that whiteness in America is not a fixed racial identity but a social construct that has historically been shaped and reshaped to maintain political power. As he said, “Whiteness is a political project… it’s always shapeshifting, it’s always adding [new groups] because it has to in order to maintain power.”
Wise highlighted the increasing assimilation of Latino and Asian groups into this framework, particularly those who are lighter-skinned and more “white-presenting.” This adaptability of whiteness allows it to survive in an era where the white population is shrinking. “The leading young neo-Nazi in America right now is Nick Fuentes… he is ancestrally Latino but he qualifies under the definition of whiteness as a political project,” Wise explained.
The Democrats’ Struggle: A Call for Cultural Competency
In his final remarks, Wise emphasized the need for progressives to be culturally competent, stating that the left must engage with working-class voters without “looking down our noses at folks.” He used the example of sports culture and the popularity of figures like Donald Trump in these spaces, noting that the left often fails to connect with the average person by rejecting these cultural touchstones. Wise put it simply: “If you can’t speak to people… you will never be relevant in this country.”
Ultimately, Wise’s conversation with Davey D underscored the importance of building authentic relationships, understanding cultural dynamics, and challenging entrenched systems of power. As Wise concluded, “People keep asking me what we’re going to do… we organize, we fight. We have to keep moving the ball forward.”
For more updates on Tim Wise’s work and insights, you can follow him on social media or visit the African American Policy Forum’s website at aapf.org.
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